[FFmpeg-devel] [RFC] Suggestion for a Nicer Integration with GitHub

[ffmpegandmahanstreamer at e.email]

August 12, 2021 4:51 AM, "Nicolas George" <george at nsup.org> wrote:

> Paul Buxton (12021-08-12):
> 
>> From the point of view of someone who is currently developing a filter for
>> ffmpeg and will be submitting a patch to the list for the first time, I
>> think this is a great idea.Whilst following simple instructions to prepare
>> and submit a patch should't be outside the ability of anyone who is capable
>> of contributing. Using something like github allows a more automated
>> workflow that can make the process smoother and even make lives easier for
>> the maintainers as it is possible for the automations to catch issues
>> before they get sent on to you.
> 
> Have you wondered why these periodical threads "we/you should make
> FFmpeg more attractive" usually end up a discussion between disgruntled
> newbies congratulating each other for their great ideas, with only the
> occasional bored experienced developer stepping in?
> 
You have no idea their experience level, or any possible past/present/future contributions to the project.
Judge the ideas, not the person.
> TL;DR: Do not make posting patches on the mailing-list easier, make a
> two-tiered system where beginners learn to make high-quality patches
> before submitting them for review to the experienced developers.
> 
> You all seem to assume that attracting more developers is always a good
> thing.
> 
> It is if it attracts promising developers, i.e. if it widens the
> horizon.
> 
> That requires probably making sure the project is seen as alive and
> progressing, with governance and direction, withe people capable of
> making decisions on the direction of the progress, to accept or clearly
> reject original ideas coming from nobodies. Right now, the project is
> adrift, changes are being "accepted" more based on who happens to have
> commit rights and neglects to seek approval from peers.
> 
you have a point here. But nothing to do with what softworkz is sugessting.
> But more developers is not a good thing if it is done by lowering the
> bar, because the more developers will be mediocre and as such a drain on
> the time of core developers.
> 
I don't think you should generalize an entire group of developers because they like something you don't.

> Patches from newbies will require review. The more clueless the newbies,
> the more time required turn the patch into something acceptable. And of
> course, patches will be discusses by core developers on the mailing
> list, so people who do not bother to optimize their mails for reading
> (see https://ffmpeg.org/pipermail/ffmpeg-devel/2021-August/283402.html )
> are especially obnoxious.
> 
Everyone starts as "newbies". Even you started off as one. Imagine if Bellard or Michael had this attitude in the beginning of ffmpeg.

> I will gladly concede that the entry bar of subscribing to a
> mailing-list is hardly adequate to achieve the objective of winnowing
> mediocre candidates. But if your proposal is to just discard the bar,
> you are entirely missing the point.
> 
> I wonder if a scheme where clueless developers are rejected in a polite
> but concise and semi-final standardized way:
> 
> # Thanks for your proposal. Your input will not be considered because it
> # contains obvious and easily avoided flaws:
> # [x] not following mailing-list rules;
> # [x] not following coding style conventions;
> # [ ] mangled or misformatted patch;
> # [ ] problems of code hygiene;
> # [x] bad commit message.
> # For details, see <http://ffmpeg.org/doc/newbies>. If you can fix
> # these flaws by yourself, you may become a valued contributor to this
> # project. If you cannot, then please go grok some PHP or something.
> 
Could be useful.
> Then feel free to set-up a Discourse or Discord or whatever kids use
> these days to help each other pass the bar. As long as what we get on
> the mailing-list are patches that are already in good shape for review,
> it is all good.
> 
So you agree with softworkz?
> Regards,
> 
> --
> Nicolas George
> 
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