[FFmpeg-devel] [RFC] Release 6.1

[Michael Niedermayer]

On Wed, Oct 04, 2023 at 05:19:17PM +0200, Anton Khirnov wrote:
> Quoting Michael Niedermayer (2023-10-03 21:22:58)
> > On Tue, Sep 26, 2023 at 08:14:37PM +0200, Anton Khirnov wrote:
> > > You keep framing this as some kind of a personal campaign against you.
> > > It is not. From my perspective, the objections to SDR have been largely
> > > technical, and most of the "heat" comes from your refusal to accept that
> > > many active developers are against it.
> > 
> > Technical arguments ?
> > Yes, several people had technical arguments, I remember Tomas and Remi and some
> > others. But at least subjectively i felt that the bulk of people where alot more
> > emotional than technical
> > 
> > But let me list a few observations, from memory
> > First objection was because processing is done in an external library.
> > Then it was found out that was wrong and actually processing is done in the new code
> > so the objection flipped and people demanded it to be moved into an external library.
> > 
> > If you object to pink and want blue and when you find out its actually blue you have
> > to be happy and become a supporter but what happened was the opposit, the objection
> > was simply adjusted to object to whatever was the case and demand whatever was not.
> > 
> > Ok so thats at least one developers "Technical objection" down here, maybe more
> > i dont know if anyone else expressed that same initial objection. but lets move on
> > 
> > In all cases we prefer not to have external dependancies, this is the Technical position of FFmpeg
> > no, there is no technical argument in this.
> > Also personal preferrances of people is not a technical argument. Noone explained why a
> > avdevice module with more external depandancies would be ok but a avdevice module with
> > fewer external depandancies was not. <-- This last sentance is a technical argument
> > I could go as far as call this a proof by contradiction.
> > 
> > If people are happy with a avdevice module and FFmpeg prefers fewer external dependancies
> > then my suggestion of first starting with a plain simple self contained avdevice/avformat
> > module, would have to be fine too.
> > We can always move this to an external library once there is a technical reason for that
> > like for example some other software wants to use it
> > 
> > About the attack/rallying/compaign stuff. Ill keep it very brief as its not useful i think.
> > Also this is my own personal and subjective view. In fact the whole mail is
> > There was alot of (negative) emotion from 1-2 people about SDR. This emotion was what spread
> > slash rallied other developers. That came before any technical arguments.
> > Now people have picked their flag and march to war.
> > 
> > Everyone will deny it, same as every patriot will fight to the death for the colors of
> > the flag of the country and religion they where born into.
> > 
> > My claim, sorry to be stubborn, is that had this started a slight bit different there
> > would be little opposition to SDR. Iam not denying that now there are several people
> > against it.
> 
> These are largely unfalsifiable claims, so I don't see how they can
> productively contribute to this discussion.
> 

> But dismissing people's concerns as "patriotic" or "religious" isn't
> helping your case IMO.

That was not my intend
i had not intended to dismiss anyones concern
What i was trying to do with this 2nd part of the mail was to document
a subjective observation. The reason was simply _IF_ this observation
is somewhat correct, then awareness of this could help people next time.
As i stated i expect noone to change their position here. But maybe
next time we have a similar growing disagreement being aware of the
possible effects of emotional statements from fellow developers could
be helpfull.

thx, and ill try to end this debate in this thread, this minor comment
just felt it fits better here

[...]
-- 
Michael     GnuPG fingerprint: 9FF2128B147EF6730BADF133611EC787040B0FAB

Breaking DRM is a little like attempting to break through a door even
though the window is wide open and the only thing in the house is a bunch
of things you dont want and which you would get tomorrow for free anyway
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