[MPlayer-users] Radeon frambuffer use if Radeon is not primary display? (all in one)

[Nick Kurshev]

Hello, Brian!

On Fri, 14 Dec 2001 11:42:31 -0500 you wrote:

> [Automatic answer: RTFM (read DOCS, FAQ), also read DOCS/bugreports.html]
> On Fri, Dec 14, 2001 at 06:23:53PM +0300, Nick Kurshev wrote:
> > 
> > Hello, Brian!
> 
> Hi Nick.
> 
> > Then XPert2000 Pro (PCI) - it's even cheaper of Radeon VE.
> 
> It doesn't seem to come in a PCI version according to ATI's own
> product spec sheet.
> 
> http://www.ati.com/na/pages/products/pc/xpert2000_pro/index.html
> 
I'm not sure - but in Russian shops you may buy such card
(PCI versiona are available for us ;)

> > Indeed there are no difference between PCI and AGP from programming point.
> 
> Tell that to A'rpi.  He says that the radeon_vid framebuffer driver
> was designed to work with AGP only:
> 
> http://mplayerhq.hu/pipermail/mplayer-users/2001-December/014053.html
> 
He was wrong ;)
radeon_vid IS NOT framebuffer driver. Framebuffer driver IS radeonfb ONLY !!!

> > My AGP is detected as PCI 1:0:0 slot.
> 
> So does my G400 and it is seen as a PCI device too:
> 
> 00.0 VGA compatible controller: Matrox Graphics, Inc. MGA G400 AGP (rev 04)
> 
> but who am I to argue with A'rpi about whether the driver in his
> package will work on a given piece of hardware or not?
A'rpi is excellent programmer but he still misunderstand some HW questions.

> > So it's no problem.
> 
> I think now we have conflicting opinions.  How do we resolve?  Anyone
> out there using radeon_vid with a PCI Radeon.
> 
I have no such reports same as vice versa ;)
At least - I ran rage128 driver with my radeon. (But rage128 driver was designed
for PCI bus).

> > Indeed there are other improvements like up(down)scaling without quality degradation
> > and some other. But mainstream of those feature is under development and currently
> > is not supported.
> 
> So the Mach64's don't have that feature?  But that feature on cards
> that do support it is not currently being used?
> 
Full list of features you can find out on the sites of their vendors ;)
Just sync and read faq.html from mplayer's DOCS - I've tried to answer
this question there.
> > IMHO - for X11 it's unknown PCI ID only ;) Because there no difference
> > between Mach64 and 3d rage from video overlay point.
> 
> I will have to take your word on that.
> 
;)
> > Do you mean - in Russia or in the world entire?
> 
> Anywhere.
> 
But what about those adertisment which declare that HDTV is regular practic for
Western Europe and America?
> > Try compute bandwidth of video stream for 2000x2000 at 32*30fps and you'll find
> > that only AGP slot is good for that.
> 
> But where are you getting 2000x2000 at 32*30fps video streams?  How soon
> do you expect to be getting them?  Surely not before another video
> card upgrade.
> 
I meant HDTV ;)
> > For K7 (200MHz of bus) you can use upto 6 PCI cards or (1 AGP4x + 1 PCI
> > without losing of performance)
> 
> But performance has already been demonstrated to not be an issue.
> Noobdy (definately not me) is going to be playing any streams that
> even come close taxing a single PCI slot.  And I certainly do not plan
> on using more than one video card.  I do have an MB with no AGP slot
> though.
> 
Probably your MB was designed for socket-7 or slot-A
In this case it would be better to upgrade MB upto socket-370 or socket-A ;)

> > > > FYI: radeonfb doesn't support TV-out. (only GATOS and VESA)
> > > 
> > > You mean the radeon framebuffer with Mplayer does not support TV-Out?
> > > 
> > With mplayer or without mplayer - it doesn't matter.
> 
> No, I was asking if the radeon_vid frame buffer that is *distributed*
> with Mplayer supports TV-Out or not.  I am guessing not.
> 
Please DON'T MIX radeon_vid and radeonfb.
radeonfb is general framebuffer for radeon chips.
But radeon_vid is driver for video overlay which even doesn't know what is graphics mode ;)
If it tells you something - radeon_vid works only with OV0_* video registers.
It can be run over radeonfb, over VESA BIOS and in the future even over X11.
(Finely over X11 it can be run already now - but there are problems with color key).
> > radeonfb is kernel module but mplayer just uses it.
> 
> I understand that.
> 
> > I guess - every modern card has HW scaling ;)
> 
> Uhm, unless you cripple a G400 (so that it essentially is a single
> headed card instead of the dual heads it does have) it does *NOT* have
Is G400 - single head?
I guessed that they can be only dual head.
> HW scaling on it's TV-Out port.
> 
Radeons have no such problems since there is only one overlay unit
which can output signal on CRTC, TV-out, DFP or on all heads simultaneously.
> > About TV-out - only matrox has support it on framebuffers.
> 
> Really?  Is that really it?  The *only* card that has TV-Out in it's
> framebuffer driver is the Matrox G400?  ~sigh~  It's a mighty
Because matroxfb driver set can do that.
> expensive card (if you can even find one these days) to use for
> displaying video on a TV.
> 
Or maybe you'll want to implement radeon_i2c driver to enable TV-out? ;)

> > VESA is only graphics server (although mplayer can output on it too)
> > It switches modes and enables tv-out on (rage128) radeons.
> > but radeon_vid (kernel module) is used over VESA.
> > For detail - read mplayer's TFM.
> 
> OK.  VESA mode looks like it has shitty performance.  Unless you use
Not sure: on my Duron-700 + Radeon VE I'm losing only rare slices of frame
on very dynamic stories of DVD. (Slice it's 1/20 if frame). Approx: 1 slice
per 50-200 frames.
> radeon or rage128 in which case it's VESA with backend scaling.  VESA
> also allows the use of TV-Out, but then there is a statement about
> TV-Out not working for radeons.  I am even more confused now.
> 
FYI: computer's world is not finished on x86 architecture.
But VESA is available only for such systems.

> > If you are interesting with speed then better choice for you - it's
> > mga_vid or radeon_vid (over framebuffer or vesa).
> 
> radeon_vid does not support TV-Out though and mga_vid requires too
> expensive (and AGP!) hardware that is no longer generally available
> for purchase.  G400 is out of production from what I can determine.
> 
> > framebuffer based gui is already implemented (but mlpayer doesn't use that)
> 
> I did find some infos on framebuffer GUIs -- GTKFB for instance.
> 
FYI: framebuffer was designed to have linux-console on non-x86 systems so it's
not toys because there no text-mode ;)
> I am starting to believe that what I want to do cannot be done with
> Mplayer.  It does not seem possible to use Mplayer on a framebuffer
> device that has HW scaling and TV-Out on reasonably priced (PCI)
> hardware.
>